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Posted by2 months ago

An animal market in China's Wuhan really was the epicenter of the Covid pandemic, according to a pair of new studies in the journal Science published Tuesday that claimed to have tipped the balance in the debate about the virus' origins

87% Upvoted
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Randy from South Park must be sweating right now

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Randy and Mickey Mouse.

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Comment removed by moderator · 2 mo. ago
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· 2 mo. ago · edited 2 mo. ago

Jokes on you guys, we lost the culture war because Tucker Carlson will just claim that "science is no longer science unless it's verified and approved by Fox News, "a propaganda media outlet n that has suggested the Earth might be Flat and climate change is defenitely a hoax and both Tucker and Putin are definitely not gay" and will then repeat his talking points from 2 months ago where he pushed a wild conspiracy theory suggested that Joe Biden and Volodymyr Zelensky created Covid 19 in a Ukraine Bio Lab as a bio weapon to wage war against Russia.

Yes this is what passes as conservative news in USA and if you think this is shocking just wait till you read conservative sites like breitbart (which to their credit are not really crazy ultra infinite insane version of Hitler but they are only slightly to the right of Hitler)

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I’m not sure how we’d ever truly find out the origin, but at this point, beyond acknowledging the fact that unregulated markets carry these risks, does this really need to be said?

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They should have learned that risk when in 2002 they had the SARS outbreak. In that case they had a Horseshoe Bat virus that got into Palm Civets in one of these markets which then broke into the human population causing lockdowns and a fairly substantial outbreak that was successfully contained with only 8,000 or so cases.

The Chinese Government said they cracked down on the wild animal trade in these wet markets, but apparently not. If Covid had a zoonotic origin as well then there would be substantial responsibility for the Chinese Government for not handling the known problem.

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Animals are carrying an implausible amount of unknown viruses that can spill into human population at any time.

Unregulated markets or not, it's bound to happen and definitely not the last time on this scale.

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· 2 mo. ago · edited 2 mo. ago

beyond acknowledging the fact that unregulated markets carry these risks, does this really need to be said?

Fs in the chat for crypto bros

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Unregulated markets and badly supervised labs.

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Considering it was “racist” to say that it came from China just a short time ago, yea.

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acknowledging the fact that unregulated markets carry these risks

How exactly would you regulate markets so that a once in a lifetime virus mutation doesn't accidentally emerge from it? Because viruses are literally everywhere.


8 more replies

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· 2 mo. ago · edited 2 mo. ago

I thought they already figured this out like a year ago. Could even pinpoint basically the stall it came from.

Edit: It's actually the same studies from when they were in pre-print. Kind of fitting the one guy was originally a lab leak proponent, and is now like ya no...

Wuhan Market Study

Edit no 2.

Interesting article on THE Wuhan lab. And no they didn't have the exact strand of COVID. The one they found in 2013 (And only had paper copies of aka the genomic sequence stored in a file) was branched off from COVID 50 years ago.

Wuhan Lab History

Edit no 3.

To all the people hanging onto the line at the end of that it doesn't disprove the lab leak. It's impossible to disprove, you can only show with a near certainty that the most likely cause is from somewhere else. Kind of like you cannot disprove that the claim that I have had sex with your mother in the last month (provided she's still living, if not you have my sincere regards on that matter). There's no way you can be 100% certain that I didn't. You can say with a high degree of certainty that I DID NOT have relations with your mother, but you can never rule it out 100% that I actually did.

So in conclusion, if you still think studies like this don't rule out the lab leak, then I laid the pipe with your mother sometime in the last month and no matter what you say it happened.

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It was big in conspiracy circles, even reaching out to the more mainstream. Jon Stewart had a famously noteworthy rant about believing it was released, accidentally or even on purpose

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Comment deleted by user · 2 mo. ago
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“‘Have we disproven the lab leak theory? No, we have not. Will we ever be able to know? No,’ said co-author Kristian Anderson of The Scripps Research Institute.” Read the article.

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You left out the best study, the one from China themselves that concludes the lab leak is the most likely scenario:

The possible origins of 2019-nCoV coronavirus

Botao Xiao

South China University of Technology

This work is supported by the National Natural Science Foundation of China

February 2020

We screened the area around the seafood market and identified two laboratories conducting research on bat coronavirus. Within ~280 meters from the market, there was the Wuhan Center for Disease Control & Prevention (WHCDC) (Figure 1, from Baidu and Google maps). WHCDC hosted animals in laboratories for research purpose, one of which was specialized in pathogens collection and identification 4- 6.

In one of their studies, 155 bats including Rhinolophus affinis were captured in Hubei province, and other 450 bats were captured in Zhejiang province 4. The expert in collection was noted in the Author Contributions (JHT). Moreover, he was broadcasted for collecting viruses on nation-wide newspapers and websites in 2017 and 2019 7,8. He described that he was once by attacked by bats and the blood of a bat shot on his skin. He knew the extreme danger of the infection so he quarantined himself for 14 days 7. In another accident, he quarantined himself again because bats peed on him. He was once thrilled for capturing a bat carrying a live tick 8.

Surgery was performed on the caged animals and the tissue samples were collected for DNA and RNA extraction and sequencing 4, 5. The tissue samples and contaminated trashes were source of pathogens. They were only ~280 meters from the seafood market. The WHCDC was also adjacent to the Union Hospital (Figure 1, bottom) where the first group of doctors were infected during this epidemic. It is plausible that the virus leaked around and some of them contaminated the initial patients in this epidemic, though solid proofs are needed in future study.

In summary, somebody was entangled with the evolution of 2019-nCoV coronavirus. In addition to origins of natural recombination and intermediate host, the killer coronavirus probably originated from a laboratory in Wuhan. Safety level may need to be reinforced in high risk biohazardous laboratories. Regulations may be taken to relocate these laboratories far away from city center and other densely populated places.

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From the article:

"Have we disproven the lab leak theory? No, we have not. Will we ever be able to know? No," said co-author Kristian Anderson of The Scripps Research Institute.


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Created Jan 25, 2008